From Nursing to Counseling: A Holistic Path with Denise Schonwald

It's Therapy Thursday!!

Discover the transformative journey of Denise Schonwald, a former critical care nurse turned licensed mental health counselor, as she integrates the worlds of mental and physical health. Her inspiring narrative, alongside insights from her children's book "Getting Back to Happy," reveals the profound connection between emotional and physical well-being. We explore how anxiety manifests physically and discuss the importance of addressing root causes for holistic healing. With a focus on gut health and the consequences of unresolved emotional issues, Denise shares her unique approach to wellness, offering listeners a fresh perspective on achieving balance.

Our dialogue extends into the realm of addiction, presenting a holistic view that intertwines mental, physical, and spiritual health. Drawing from my book "Healing Your Body by Mastering Your Mind," we examine the body's way of signaling distress and the role of addictions in providing temporary relief. We emphasize the necessity of addressing underlying issues to truly break free from addictive cycles, likening the process to peeling away the layers of an onion. This layered healing journey encourages listeners to view addictive patterns from a new angle, understanding the intricate interplay of emotions and behaviors.

Navigating the complexities of trauma, spirituality, and domestic violence in therapy, we stress the importance of a safe, supportive environment. Whether it's learning to trust one's body, finding the right therapist, or understanding the dynamics of abusive relationships, our conversation offers practical insights and personal anecdotes. We discuss the spiritual dimension of healing and decision-making, providing valuable tools for listeners seeking alternative health practices. As the episode concludes, listeners are reminded of the power of community engagement and are encouraged to explore diverse approaches to personal and professional growth.

Links:

Website: https://deniseschonwald.com/
Facebook:https://www.facebook.com/deniseschonwaldllc/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@deniseschonwald/videos
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/denise-schonwald/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/deniseschonwald/

Chapters

• 0:05 Mind-Body Healing Connection
• 8:29 Healing Addiction Through Holistic Therapy
• 21:43 Navigating Trauma in Therapy
• 25:56 Learning to Trust Your Body's Wisdom
• 31:46 Supporting Domestic Violence Victims in Therapy
• 39:21 Healing and Transitioning Through Spirituality
• 53:48 Exploring Alternative Health and Coaching

Transcript

Candace Patrice: 0:05

Hello and welcome back to another episode of Essential Mental Healing where I am your host, candice Fleming, joining me. Today we have my wonderful, lovely co-host, janet Hale my lovely mother. And we also have a wonderful guest joining us today, who's all about the holistic healing, and you all know how I feel about that, so let's welcome Denise. Hi, welcome Denise. How are you? How are you?

Denise Schonwald: 0:49

Doing well, thank you. Thank you for having me.

Candace Patrice: 0:52

Absolutely, absolutely. Could you tell our listeners a little bit about you, how you got started, what you do right now, and then we're going to jump on in this thing.

Denise Schonwald: 1:02

Hello everyone, I'm Denise Schonwald. I started my career as a critical care nurse more than 30 years ago and about 10 years ago I decided to bridge over and I'm now a licensed mental health counselor practicing here in Sarasota, Florida, but nationally licensed also, so I see clients all over the United States, which is really great. Licensed also, so I see clients all over the United States, which is really great. And I've authored about four books now talking about how our mental health affects our physical health, so combining both of my licenses to help people obtain optimal wellness.

Candace Patrice: 1:38

Nice. I actually had the pleasure of reading one of your books. I didn't get to the other, which I'm so looking forward to because I saw it had the chakras and things in it and I'm really big on that opening our chakras, and I can tell when my chakras are open because my heart is more open. Yes, but I know I'm jumping in really early, really early. But there is this book called getting back to happy, which is a children's book, and would you hold that back up? Yeah, getting back to happy and this book I read with me and my daughter were playing a Barbies and or not Barbies dolls. She has some dolls that were handed down to her the ceramic, beautiful dolls and we were playing and it was one of the ways to get the dolls back on track. So in the middle of play, we decided to read the book.

Candace Patrice: 2:33

When I tell you, my daughter thought this book was written for her and was about her. She loved it so much and we are from Michigan, so when her parents were, her grandparents were from Michigan, she was like, oh my goodness, and each time we would turn the page she would go that's me, that's me. And then she's in therapy as well, so she would go. That's her therapist, that's her therapist, that's my therapist and she just the therapy that she was getting, it's emotional support. She went know that it was based off of a little girl's story. Yes, could you tell us a little bit about that journey, how you got to this book, and then we'll get back to all of the other things.

Denise Schonwald: 3:37

This little girl in the book came to me about a year ago. Her mother had taken her to all kinds of doctors for stomach issues, so she had been to a nutritionist and a chiropractor and finally she hired her a life coach and the coach said you know, I really think she could benefit from some mental health counseling. And it turned out that a lot of her stomach issues were just because she had a lot of anxiety. Somebody was making fun of her at school, and so she would wake up in the morning very sick on her stomach, couldn't eat, had trouble leaving her mom when she got to school and not realizing that a lot of this was more mental than physical, even though they had eliminated a lot of foods in her diet which made it hard when she went to parties and birthday parties and so forth.

Denise Schonwald: 4:29

And so she doesn't live near me, so we would meet on Zoom and at the end of every session she would want to read me one of her books. So she was a big reader and so I said you know it might be really helpful if you could write a book about your story. And so you know she was. She was great. She had a lot of really good input and we wrote it together and and a lot of the children that read it think I've written it for them, which is fantastic.

Candace Patrice: 4:57

Yes, that is. That is extremely beautiful. I actually have gut issues as well. I have ulcerative colitis beautiful, I actually have gut issues as well. I have ulcerative colitis. And seeing how it doesn't really manifest in my gut it manifests in my eyes so I have to take steroids for it but seeing how the gut it affects so much of us but I didn't realize that the mental affects the gut, which then in turn affects everything. It's like a reciprocal thing. So getting that help in all areas so you combining physical and mental is amazing.

Janet Hale: 5:33

Did you have?

Candace Patrice: 5:34

something to say, mom.

Janet Hale: 5:35

Yes, I did. Thank you, and I hope that our millions of listeners hear you, because a lot of times people are not getting to the root of the issue and it sounds to me that you are one that will go right to the root of the issue and not put a Band-Aid on it. And I'm going to speak to just a real laid-back situation here. But I'm going to speak to Candace's situation, which she just mentioned mentioned to the public on her own.

Janet Hale: 6:25

So I'm not disclosing anything, as she has not. I want to make that clear, make that disclaimer. Oftentimes I would ask were you affected by me and your dad's divorce? Were you affected by my trauma that I had not dealt with, that I allowed to parent during that time, before I knew better? The answer is always no.

Janet Hale: 7:10

I ask that question often because I'm a recovering alcoholic. I heard her dad, you know, got divorced and he died on I don't know, I feel like that was a joke he did on me, but that's okay, because it was a year after and then, boom, I'm out. But that's okay, but cause it was a year after and then boom, I'm out. But but to hear that, I find that to be extremely important. It's even in this situation, in this circle, in hearing that, because my question will continue to be that for my daughter, because she lived through some trauma and, as the mother who sits with her adult daughter can say, I know that you suffered through my untreated trauma, through my parenting, from my trauma reactions. So I will continue to ask that question until someone like you come around to help.

Denise Schonwald: 8:24

So thank you, you're welcome.

Candace Patrice: 8:27

I have a question for you. I know I jumped into the children's book, but you have four books. Is your passion in children or adults, or does it not matter?

Denise Schonwald: 8:42

Certainly I work with both, but three of my other books are all more adults. One's on relationships, one's how our mental health affects our physical health and the other one is just called Insightful Self-Therapy. I took a lot of topics that people often ask me about and just wrote like a daily devotional for people to read about all kinds of issues that are many times sort of the topic of conversation.

Candace Patrice: 9:09

Yeah, which one is your favorite book and why?

Denise Schonwald: 9:13

My favorite is Healing your Body by Mastering your Mind, and so how I sort of that came to me is one of the things I loved about nursing and I loved about the body is the body is very sophisticated and the body will let you know what's happening, what's going on with it, through pain or some sort of symptom, and we're usually pretty good about noticing that and going to the doctor.

Denise Schonwald: 9:39

When I bridged over to mental health, I was a little bit concerned because I felt like mental health issues were a little blurry, like why do some people have anxiety? Why do some people overeat? Why do all these things happen? And then I realized a lot of things. I sort of a lot of patterns about how and so certain emotions affect certain parts of the body, and so now I really understand the science behind mental health and why we're doing what we're doing and how the body's being impacted. So when I wrote that book, I tried to sort of bring it all together so that it was sort of easy to read, digestible and helped people sort of bridge and combine mental, spiritual and physical health.

Candace Patrice: 10:30

So, would you say, the need to feel is what is kind of? How do I phrase this? So people have addictions because they usually are dealing with something else, whether it's anger, whether it's trauma, all of the things. So the addiction creates this feeling, but I'm assuming it creates this happy feeling that's unable to be attained mentally. So is it safe to say that addictions or the? I'm so lost for how to say this. I can help you with that, please, please, someone jump in.

Janet Hale: 11:18

I'm thinking of adaptive behaviors, but go ahead Go ahead.

Denise Schonwald: 11:37

Well, what happens is when we need to learn something or when we need to grow or manifest whatever. Emotions that we experience are usually pretty uncomfortable or we would never pay attention to them. And most of, or many of the things that we experience we experience, we learn from, and then they leave the body. Certain emotions we don't really struggle with, but there are certain ones that sit in the body and they're very hard for the body to hold. They cause the body to stress quite a bit.

Denise Schonwald: 11:59

After a while, the mind gets very active and we start to think and overthink and worry and have guilt and so forth. And then what happens is, after a while, the body doesn't know that a lot of it we make up because we do make up a lot of things we imagine a lot of things. We imagine what people are thinking and saying and doing and where we're going to be in two years or what's going to happen to us. After a while the body gets tired. The body says, listen, I can't do this anymore. So then the mind comes in and says, well, I've got a good idea. The mind's going to remember something that maybe will give it some relief. And this is where shopping comes in food, alcohol, all kinds of things, smoking, marijuana and then the mind gets very connected to or attached to whatever it's come up with, and this is where addiction sort of starts to creep in.

Janet Hale: 12:58

May I? Oh, okay, may I when you were talking first of all, I don't know if I just said this, but the body keeps the score. Yes, love the book. Yeah, because it's almost that. For me, it is a way of numbing. Whatever that hurt is, it's a way to comfort. Whatever that hurt is, it's a way to comfort.

Denise Schonwald: 13:24

Yes.

Janet Hale: 13:25

Whatever that hurt is, and so it's, in my opinion, it's actually, I know, for me it was a thank you to the addiction and a goodbye to the addiction, and I think you get what.

Janet Hale: 13:51

I'm saying so thank you for being there for me in the way, although it was a crazy way, but for helping me get through whatever it was that I had not dealt with. Yes, that I thought I was so afraid of. Whatever that may be. Yes, now I must say goodbye to you. However, before I say my goodbye, let me thank you, because it also serves a purpose.

Denise Schonwald: 14:18

Absolutely Now, I no longer need you.

Janet Hale: 14:22

I no longer need you, right, yes, so now I'm saying goodbye like a relationship we're about to break up.

Denise Schonwald: 14:33

And sometimes if we don't heal sort of what caused that, we will just go to another addiction. So we have to be a little bit careful that if there's no true healing then the mind goes okay, I'll pick something else, since I'm going to, or now we're going to smoke, or now we're going to get whatever that is. So it's very important and we're so afraid to go down to where that pain is to release it that we'll do almost anything to not feel it.

Janet Hale: 15:11

Oh, you're good. Okay, all right. Yes, ma'am, yes, ma'am, yes, ma'am, yes, ma'am. And also I thought about when you were talking in the healing process, because it doesn't happen overnight, you know that.

Denise Schonwald: 15:24

Correct.

Janet Hale: 15:31

Been in out when you were talking in the healing process, because it doesn't happen overnight. You know that, correct, been in this business, um, and sometimes it's like an onion. It's a layer, right, I don't know. You tell me if I'm right or wrong. Okay, yes, um, it's a layer. So there's this part that, okay, discovered blah, blah, blah, dealt with that. The ooh, there's something else. Oh, I didn't know that was there. Now I have to look at that, or not? Hopefully you do. Let's take this deep dive again.

Denise Schonwald: 15:57

I say we pack it in like snow. Pack it in like snow.

Janet Hale: 16:02

And so when you said that, I thought that was cool Because, yeah, if we're not careful and open, we will transfer our addiction.

Denise Schonwald: 16:12

Yes.

Janet Hale: 16:12

However, for me, when that transfer is happening, I start identifying. In other words, we'll be real transparent on this show because we are for me. Sometimes I'll pick up the eating and I'll say this all out this is what's interesting, I'll do this. So I'm eating away at my feelings, I'm talking it out. It's still happening, but I'm talking it out, it's still happening, but I'm identifying it Right, and so it's like the whole thing of okay, the work needs to be done.

Janet Hale: 17:03

I need to get started, or whatever that is for me Also, I'm so. Oh man, I understand. You do holistic work, which I think is very important, which is something that is often missed and how sometimes I want to say this not make people, not, no, I'm going to say it. Sometimes therapy doesn't work because it depends on and I always say this the therapist Is that, you know, is this therapist? Does it know it? Does this therapist know anything about trauma? Is this a traditional way that people do things? Are they open to new ways of doing things, because times are changing and you appear to be someone who is staying on top of the next thing, like, yeah, we used to do it this way. Okay, now we're learning that we need to do it this way.

Denise Schonwald: 18:06

Well, certainly the body is very good about letting us know what it needs. As I said before, we're very good with physical problems, emotional problems we're not quite as good with. We live with our anxiety, we push through our guilt, and so a lot of times we're not realizing that the body, these are symptoms that our nervous system is out of balance.

Candace Patrice: 18:34

I have a question, Of course I have many questions. So would you say that fixing the mind can fix the addiction?

Denise Schonwald: 18:43

Yes, learning, noticing, why the body? Why do I need to do this? What is it that I'm looking for that I'm not getting? Because, again, when the nervous system is stressed, the body can't hold it for long periods of time without getting sick, and so then the mind comes in and will connect to something outside in the environment to feel better. Depending upon which addiction you're going to tells me what emotions you're struggling with.

Candace Patrice: 19:21

This is a two-parter. Hmm, this is a two-parter. So I heard you say the body can't. It can't hold on to the discomfort for too long. But how long can the body hold on to some discomfort or stress in the body or mind before it becomes uncomfortable and starts to reach out for some other form of healing?

Denise Schonwald: 19:45

Well, a lot of times people live with their discomfort for years and years and years, uncomfortable, and starts to reach out for some other form of healing. Well, a lot of times people live with their discomfort for years and years and years and that comes out in physical problems such as autoimmune, like fibromyalgia MS, I mean these are, and so what that tells me is that discomfort has been in the body a long long time?

Candace Patrice: 20:13

Wow. So I know that alcohol is, or at least I've been told. I didn't really do the research, but I trust the source it came from, that alcohol is one of the only addictions that you can't go cold turkey with.

Denise Schonwald: 20:34

It's certainly one of the most it's very dangerous to withdraw from. So a lot of times you need some medical help with that. I mean, that's one that the body gets very dependent. When people would come in to have surgery and go into critical care, they'd often say that they didn't drink as much as they did. But day two or three, when they started to get you know the DTs and and started to be at having this psychosis, we realized they were drinking a little bit more than they had admitted to. But but alcohol there's certain, there's energies in the body and alcohol is the solar plexus. So that's the stomach, that's our energy around the stomach and that says that our relationship with ourselves is not healthy. Fear is there, sensitivity and criticism is there. Not feeling that we can stand up and speak for ourselves is there. So when that gets trust, is there. When that gets blocked, we either overeat, don't eat or drink alcohol. So we have to understand why the body, why the alcohol as opposed to something else.

Janet Hale: 21:43

You made me think of something, and and that is this going into a therapist office with a hangover, pretty much with the shakes on the way to a, and say my name is Janet and I've been in recovery for so many years and I've had a relapse. Now I'm actively drinking. I know I'm sitting in this therapy chair, but I'm sitting here because I need help. I tell you about the act of drinking because I'm real glad you have coffee right here, because I need it. Also, to say I'm bringing my whole self to this process Because, in order to get better, I got to let you know who I am and I must expose those pieces of me.

Janet Hale: 22:57

You know I can't come in here and say you know, I have a glass of wine every now and then, nope, that's not what's happening. The line every now and then, nope, that's not what's happening. So I appreciate that. When you said, people will say you know, I've only, I only have a beer once a week until they get somewhere, and then they have the dt's and different things of that nature. So, um, yeah, so thank you for that.

Denise Schonwald: 23:19

as you know, it's very painful because it's, and so it's hard, and I understand that. And so in therapy it's important to honor the person sitting in front of you. If they're not ready to talk about their trauma, it's certainly not appropriate to pull it out of them for the sake of you know. So you have to allow this space that a person's comfortable with to process it, and if they're not ready, you also have to allow this space that a person's comfortable with to process it. And if they're not ready, you also have to honor that, because some people are just not ready.

Candace Patrice: 23:56

How would you suggest so someone going into therapy who's not ready to deal with their traumas, but they're just, they know they need it and so they're seeking assistance? How would you suggest to a person to advocate for themselves when they're being pushed in places that are too uncomfortable or too raw for them at that time?

Denise Schonwald: 24:18

One of the first questions that I ask when I meet someone is is there, do you have any trauma that you feel is important to share? And they may say no, and it's pretty apparent to me there's probably something there, but they're not ready. Okay, I have to honor that, so we'll talk about other things and eventually, hopefully, you have a good enough relationship where they start to let it out and when they do let it out, you let it come out at the pace that they're comfortable. Sort of ripping the bandaid open is not going to do anything. This is something that they've held sometimes since childhood. This has been in the body for many, many years and they have to feel safe and they have to feel comfortable to start to let it out because it's become a part of them, even though they don't like it too much.

Candace Patrice: 25:13

So what should the client do when they're in that position? What advice would you give to them if they're sitting in a room and the therapist or the counselor is saying, hey, tell me, let's dig deep into that trauma? I think you know we need to really touch on that, but maybe this is a person who's never stood up for themselves and they're uncomfortable. What is a way that they can, or what should they do? Should they let the therapist know? Do they need to seek another therapist? What? What would be your suggestion to someone in this uncomfortable situation?

Denise Schonwald: 25:47

I would say to the therapist I know there's a lot of things that I need to talk about. I'm just not at that point yet. People ask me all the time how do I find a good therapist and it's one that you feel comfortable with? If you walk out of that session and it just doesn't sit right not in the mind but in the body then you've got to go. You know, maybe I should try to find someone else that I feel more comfortable with. So you know, it's an art as well as a skill.

Candace Patrice: 26:20

Nice, and I know that you are also a spiritual teacher. Yes, what does spiritual teacher mean to you, and what does that look like?

Denise Schonwald: 26:29

One of the other questions that I ask when I first meet someone is are you religious? And they might say no, no, I have no faith, and so forth, but at some point I have to. It's important for me to bring in spirituality, because spirituality is outside the mind, and so what I'll do is I'll use language like the way the universe teaches us. If they're religious, I say this is how God teaches us. So I tend to tailor spirituality into the language that they're more comfortable with. But it's very important because it's the spirit, or the energy is really how we learn. If the mind doesn't fight it, which the mind usually comes in to fight, what is comes in to fight.

Candace Patrice: 27:32

What is so? I, like I said, I noticed that your book, the hold on I want to say it right Healing the body by mastering your mind is classified in chapter or broken down in chapters by chakras. So what is your correlation with energy and chakras and God and spiritual universe? What is that for you?

Denise Schonwald: 27:51

It's interesting. I grew up in a very religious home. I went to Christian school and prayer meeting and so forth. So certainly talking about chakras and all of that was frowned upon and maybe even considered sacrilegious. And as I started to understand what they, as I really started to study them, I realized that the chakras are how God speaks to us. We sense things in the body because God is trying to get us to notice things, and so I decided it's like let me study this, because what is this trying to teach? Certainly, like the Hindu and different religions are going back to the chakras. There's got to be something there and the chakras are sort of will give us the emotional anatomy, because certain emotions will. Sort of chakras are a wheel or a disc and different emotions are processed through the different chakras, which is very important as a therapist that I understand where these emotions are being processed in the body and how they're manifesting physically if they're not addressed.

Janet Hale: 29:09

I have a question about that, because I truly agree with that. So when you're talking to someone in layman's terms and they come to you and they say you know, I'm learning to trust my body, I'm learning to trust what I feel, yes. I'm learning to you know, understand when I'm uncomfortable. I'm learning to just all those kind of things. How do you deal with that? Because I hear I agree totally with you. I believe in that. I really do Like the universe all that.

Janet Hale: 29:48

I call myself the hippie because of that, because I'm open to whatever it is that you're into, without judgment. No, no, I'm saying without judgment, but if a client comes to you and they're learning their body, learning how to listen to the body, because you know part of the trauma is learning how to turn that off Right.

Denise Schonwald: 30:17

Or learning to make peace with it.

Janet Hale: 30:19

Or learning to make peace with it. And so, or okay, and so when a person starts to feel and understand that and learn to trust the body and what it's saying, and they come to you, how do you handle that in layman's terms? Because they're not going to know the verbiage, they're not going to know all of that Correct, we do, but they're not going to know that. So in which way? How would you?

Denise Schonwald: 30:48

handle that and certainly what I try to, I explain, is that certain emotions are processed in different parts of the body. So if they say something like this person in my life, I don't trust them and I feel it in my stomach, or or I get a gut feeling. I say, okay, well, that's one of the places when, when it's sort of our I call them our Spidey senses you know, it's below the thinking mind, because we actually feel it in the body and so what I say to them is and they say, but I don't want to leave him or I don't want to leave her, but I have this feeling and I say, ok, well then give it some space, because certainly we don't want to jump in and make a rash decision, or they don't, but yet they have this sensation in the body and I say, ok, let's give it some space, because one thing with energy is it will always play out one way or another.

Janet Hale: 31:46

Oh, I have a question and you just tell me so when, when, if you have a client who is dealing with domestic violence, who is living with her abuser, who you know, he's the financial provider he's you know all the things, all the things and they, they come to you and I heard you say give it space, but in their environment, you know it's constricted or you know suffocating, or they're not even allowed to go to the bathroom.

Denise Schonwald: 32:21

I don't know how.

Janet Hale: 32:23

in what way would you assist that person?

Denise Schonwald: 32:27

You'd be a perfect person for the book that I've written called Elephants. Don't Marry Giraffes. Oh, it's not me, no, no. But since you're interested in relationships, it would be a wonderful book. Oh, I am, yeah, okay, the interesting thing about relationships, particularly when we're talking about domestic violence, is one of the things that I have to understand as a therapist is this is their dynamic. Even though it's completely dysfunctional and toxic, and although it seems like a very easy thing to fix or to recommend, it's not so easy because they've come together for a reason. Somebody who's controlling and abusive will prey upon somebody who will allow them to do that, and so I'm honest with them, to tell them that this person will likely not change. But for them to push through the fear of moving out can be very dangerous. It's one of the most dangerous calls that the police get called out for is domestic violence.

Janet Hale: 33:35

So, in speaking on that, how I know we're just going all over the place with this, but how do you deal with a domestic violence victim, one who is? They have cultural differences you know backgrounds, you know different backgrounds and some come from a privileged background, yes, and have different resources, you know and then someone who does not have all those resources. How, in what way, do you balance that or how do you work that out?

Denise Schonwald: 34:17

Fortunately, regardless of your economic status, there are many places that will help. Unfortunately, it's a little bit more complicated than that, because of the relationship is completely toxic and it's been like that. I call them dysfunctionally functional and even though you may recommend that one of them leave a lot of times, they'll go right back into that environment even though it's dangerous for whatever reason. No heat, no judgment, but we do the best we can.

Janet Hale: 34:55

So the question still for me is when we're dealing with privileged and non-privileged, because there is a difference, true, and so the circumstance is what the circumstance is, and they're both dealing with the same type of abuse, living in the same type of situation. And I hear you saying there are resources, um, however, for some folks, not really yeah and that's just me being. You know we're having an authentic, honest conversation yeah so my question to you is how do you handle that when you're dealing with the client or does that ever come up?

Denise Schonwald: 35:41

Well, a lot of the ones that I see and believe it or not, the two most horrific cases that I've had were both doctors, if you can believe that. One was a friend of mine that I mentioned in the book. At the end he killed her. At the end she finally left him and he killed her. The other one was the most horrific abuse I've ever heard. They were both doctors. So we think that we sort of have a vision of who gets into these situations and I guess we never know.

Janet Hale: 36:15

No, no, that's not my question. I know.

Denise Schonwald: 36:17

But yeah, with with people who don't have the means, it can be very, it can be very complicated because there's a lot to it and are are they at the point where they need they need help or they're willing to have help. A lot of them come to me that in my experience where they'll say I just want you to help me learn to tolerate it and you know it's, it's something that I can't help them. Do they want to learn how to tolerate their abusive husband or or it's? I guess I'm going around the bush, because you're asking me something very, very complicated and complex and no two cases look alike and there's so many variables that it can be hard to give you sort of a straightforward answer.

Janet Hale: 37:15

I can respect that and thank you.

Candace Patrice: 37:19

You have your books. Yes, books and your books are tools. They have information, they have guidance. For someone who is hearing about your name for the first time and going, I want to know a little more about her. Which book would you suggest people start at? Or is there an area and it's like, well, if you're dealing with this, you should start here? If you're dealing with this, you should start here. Where would you suggest the listeners or anyone hearing your name for the first time to start with you with your written work?

Denise Schonwald: 37:51

What I ask people to do is to go to my website and read about all of them, because I used to always start with healing your body by mastering your mind. But then I would start to get email back and say I was really interested in elephants, don't marry giraffes. So you know, it really depends upon what sort of people connect to, and normally if people email me, I'm happy to mail them a free copy of one of the books. But I've learned now to get them to read about so they don't get disappointed when they don't get the book that they were hoping to get.

Candace Patrice: 38:27

Yeah, you know getting back to happy because apparently that's my book.

Janet Hale: 38:31

Now that's the top of my list, the top of my list.

Candace Patrice: 38:35

I would personally like to. If there are any mothers listening, I would like to personally recommend that book to all mothers, whether you're a mother of a daughter or a mother of a son. It's really helpful in understanding the journey of a child and their need for a safe place to be able to figure out and work through things. So I do, I just. It's called Getting Back to Happy everyone and it's beautifully illustrated and it's not a hard read. It has just enough information that the kids at almost any age can understand what is going on. So I just wanted to throw that out there.

Candace Patrice: 39:21

Secondly, I wanted to ask if, knowing that you have your spiritual background, do you feel like you're doing God's work? And if you do, when did you know that you were doing the work that you were supposed to do, especially transitioning from nursing to counseling, and that changes you? You're into very important fields. You're helping in both fields, so how is it that you were able to make that change and know that that change was needed for you, and doing that in God's will and God's word, and doing that in God's will and God's?

Denise Schonwald: 39:56

word. It's interesting because there comes a time nursing is for the young, particularly critical care, and when I figured I was no longer going to be physically able to do that, going back to become a therapist was another five years and many people didn't understand why I would do that at my age and I didn't need to do that, and why would you want to do that? I got a lot of that, but I felt like I had learned so much as a critical care nurse that I had really good critical thinking skills and I really wanted to do that. I really wanted to fulfill my dharma, my purpose, here. I really wanted to do that. I really wanted to fulfill my dharma, my purpose here.

Denise Schonwald: 40:41

And so, as you know, if you work with counseling others, it can be really tough. I mean, you're going into a sacred space and certainly my intention is never to harm or to make it worse. So every day, before I even start, I pray for guidance and I pray for God to channel through me, because I feel like I can be the voice of the divine. Sometimes I say things that I have no memory of. Sometimes, in a very sticky situation, I'll say to myself help, help, help. And then, all of a sudden, something comes out of me and I'm like I mean, I'm grateful for that. I'm like thank you very much, whoever was responsible for that, because I really needed it.

Candace Patrice: 41:24

I had someone share with me recently. They were. They said I know it was the Holy Spirit speaking because I'm not that smart.

Denise Schonwald: 41:34

And if they asked me to repeat it, I could never repeat it, never repeat it. I'm thinking, I have no idea, but and and they'll say you know, I was thinking the same thing or something. And I think, well, I don't, don't even remember what I was thinking, but and I know that that's the divine, and as long as I can continue to do that, I will continue practicing.

Candace Patrice: 41:54

I want to go backwards just a little bit.

Denise Schonwald: 42:14

We talked about food and the gut and mental, and obviously food plays a part in our mental. How does food play a part in our mental and how does food play a part in our healing? It's interesting with food when the mind is very active. So we're struggling with whatever we're struggling with. The first thing that we go to I don't know why, because it's not our best resource is the mind, and the mind will start thinking and overthinking and thinking ahead and going behind Mind's very busy thinking and thinking ahead and going behind Mine's very busy thinking, thinking, thinking. We don't realize how much energy that takes for the body to handle. So the body's excreting cortisol and it's I mean it's working because it thinks that everything that we're thinking in our mind is true, and so after a while the body will say listen, if you're gonna keep doing this, I need some energy because you're killing me down here.

Denise Schonwald: 43:01

So the first thing that we go to without even thinking is to the refrigerator. We're not getting carrots and a salad, we're getting sugar and carbs. We need something that will quickly convert to energy because the mind is using it up as quickly as it possibly can. I notice it with myself. I'll be stressed about something. First I noticed that I'm pacing back and forth and then all of a sudden I think, oh, I'm hungry. And then I think just ate. And I go no, I'm hungry because I'm stressed and I'm thinking, and my body needs the sugar or the carbs or whatever I'm going for. Wow, can I add to?

Janet Hale: 43:45

that what I heard, what I got to say that way, I'm still hungry because I haven't fed whatever it was that was bothering me. So, yeah, when I heard you talking I was like, yeah, you still hungry. You hungry Because you have not fed that thing that needs to be fed.

Candace Patrice: 44:05

Yes, so how much time should we pause before trying to fix that momentary problem? So if it's stress in our bodies, stress in our minds, and we go you know what? I'm hungry how much time should we just wait and say this isn't that? Well, it's usually so.

Denise Schonwald: 44:24

They say about 20 minutes, but what I tell people to do is notice what is the body trying to say, Like if I'm irritable or I'm overthinking. This is again a symptom. It's like if we're physical, it's like chest pain. We need to stop and get into our what they call your higher self, your smarter self, and say okay, what's going on? What do I need? Well, if somebody hurt my feelings or I've had a stressful day, take a minute and decide what else you can do other than go for something quick. That's probably not going to do the trick. It will for a little bit. That's why we do it, but it's not going to fix it. So what do you need? With me? I can usually track it back to I don't know, I'm working too much, I didn't get much sleep, I'm overwhelmed, and then I go okay, that's fine, let's make some adjustments so that we don't get to the point where we're looking in the refrigerator every 15 minutes.

Candace Patrice: 45:26

So what questions should we be asking ourselves in these moments of stress? What would be good questions? What?

Denise Schonwald: 45:32

do I need. What's going on? What do I need right now? How am I feeling? And I give people language I'm overwhelmed, I'm frustrated, I'm disappointed. Okay, that's why we need to go to the refrigerator, because these emotions are uncomfortable and the mind doesn't like to be uncomfortable.

Candace Patrice: 45:57

And would you say, asking yourself these questions and giving yourselves an answer helps comfort the mind.

Denise Schonwald: 46:05

It certainly can get the mind to calm down because we get into what you call your higher self, your godly self, and it's deciding what you need. If we get to the point where we're so angry that we're let somebody have it, it's too late. By the time we get the whole cake out, it's probably too late. You know that we get to that sort of that tipping or we get the whole bottle of alcohol out, it's probably too late. The mind has taken back over. It's just the more that we practice going into what we call your higher self and doing a lot of self-care. It's not usually as difficult.

Candace Patrice: 46:49

Yeah, you know, Denise, you've been amazing and full of so much knowledge, and full of so much knowledge I want to. I know we're going to have to wrap up, but I want to ask if there is anything that you want to let the listeners know regarding mental health, physical health, spiritual health, any areas that you we didn't touch on that you really need the listeners to hear. I want to open the space for you to do that, if there is anything.

Denise Schonwald: 47:22

Yes, one of the things that I would like to encourage everybody listening today is do the self-care. It's so easy to get wrapped up in the stress of life and bills and family and everything else. Particularly we as women have a lot on our plates. Do the self-care. Take time if you need to take a nap or you need to get to bed early. Be careful not to use too much screen time Very hard on the mind. Take some time in either prayer or meditation. Create the space, make the time for yourself, and all of these mental health issues will become a little bit more manageable. Get help if you need it.

Janet Hale: 48:05

I myself have a therapist, so my mom is very big on that, right, she's right. I was about to say my therapist. I said, do you have a therapist? And she said, oh, you know, do you have a therapist? And she said, you know, yeah, I have. I said, well, because I was about to fire you and because that's important, it is important and that is something you know. Like Candice said, mom was into that, but I just find it important for others to have that knowledge and understand that a therapist is a person that has to carry a lot and they also need a relief. Yes, and I need a therapist that gets her relief, because when she gets through with one of my senses I'm joking, are you A little bit? But I like the fact that you know to hear that you have your own therapist.

Janet Hale: 49:12

And I think it's okay, for I don't know if it's okay, but I think it's okay for the client to be able to ask that question and that that can be a requirement for some people.

Denise Schonwald: 49:28

And healing your body by mastering your mind. At the end of each chapter, I wrote my own story. It's a lot of people's favorite part of the book. Not that they wanted to know that I was struggling with things, but they wanted to know that just because I have the knowledge and the expertise doesn't mean that I don't struggle. And it was a little bit tough to write something that thousands and thousands of people were going to read, but I felt like it was important to let people know that everybody struggles. That's how we connect to each other.

Candace Patrice: 50:02

Can you just say the name of all your books again and also where people can find you? Are you private pay or insurance?

Denise Schonwald: 50:14

I have both, so I accept most insurances, which is very nice.

Candace Patrice: 50:19

Yes, yes, so can you give us that so that the listeners and then spell your name for those who are? Just listening and maybe not looking, sure, so.

Denise Schonwald: 50:29

Denise D-E-N-I-S-E Schoenwald, s-c-h-o-n-w-a-l-d, which is com, which is my website. Okay, so my first book is Healing your Body by Mastering your Mind. These are all on Amazon, but if the listener would like to pick one, I will mail one for free, but they are available on Amazon. Elephants, Don't Marry Giraffes, which is my book on relationships. I like that, janet. You would like this just because this is an interesting topic for you, so that you might enjoy that one Insightful Self-Therapy. It's a really good one and Candice's favorite. Getting Back to Happy.

Janet Hale: 51:20

Yeah, that's a good one. She told me about that, yeah, oh, and I also wanted to say it's a high compliment that my granddaughter, her daughter, was so pleased with your book. So for us, or for me, that's a real high compliment, because she's a very brutally honest kid. She's the type that's not in the middle. I don't want to read this anymore.

Candace Patrice: 51:51

So, yeah, I wanted to say that, and where are your social media handles?

Denise Schonwald: 51:55

Where are your social media handles? Oh, I'm at Denise Schoenwald. I'm on Facebook, instagram, just, fortunately, my name is mine and only mine, because it's complicated. You can find me. My cell phone number is on my website.

Candace Patrice: 52:16

Be happy to hear from anybody that would like to call me. Oh, that's so awesome. We talked about a lot of things. We talked about a lot of trauma that could happen, how to heal our bodies and minds and things, and everyone, like you said, they're not always ready. But if you are ready and maybe you don't have a therapist, you can definitely call or text the National Suicide Prevention Line at 988. They're available 24 hours a day, seven days a week. It's at least a start to get going if that's where you are. But we also have our beautiful resource, denise, who is nationally licensed Like whoa. She's amazing.

Candace Patrice: 52:54

So, give her a call. Are you accepting new clients right now and so give her a call. I was accepting new clients right now, and so give her a call.

Denise Schonwald: 52:59

I was going to say on my website is my calendar. So if people want to schedule an appointment, it's easy to do.

Candace Patrice: 53:06

Are they able to put their insurance information in during that time?

Denise Schonwald: 53:09

They request an appointment and then my assistant gets all their insurance information and gets make sure everything is taken care of. So when they come in we're ready to get started.

Candace Patrice: 53:18

Is Nicole your assistant still no.

Denise Schonwald: 53:21

Nicole was helping me with a lot of social media, but I've had Cindy for 15 years.

Candace Patrice: 53:28

Okay, cause I read at the back of the book how she did the illustrations for the book.

Janet Hale: 53:44

Nicole Rodriguez, so that was pretty awesome. Did you have any last words you wanted to give mom? Oh, it's been a pleasure, and thank you so much, denise, for being a part of this and providing the information to our listeners so that they can know that there are different ways of doing things, and that's what we're about. Yes, alternative ways of getting things done, so thank you.

Candace Patrice: 54:03

And, of course, I hope you all learned and gained something very valuable. This was very, very great information, as our podcast aims to give our listeners great information and valuable information. As you all know, I may have mentioned in the last episode, I am doing one-on-one spiritual life coaching, christian life coaching and mindset development coaching. So if you're interested, you can go to the website and book a consultation at essentialmotivationcom. I can be reached via email at Candice Fleming at essentialmotivationcom. Facebook is Essential Motivation and Instagram is being converted from Essential Motivation LLC to Candice Patrice underscore EM, which is me blending my personal page with my professional page. So, everybody, thank you so much. We look forward to hearing from you. If there's a topic that you want us to share, definitely go ahead and email that. If there are any comments that you want to leave, email that. We'd love to put your voice on the podcast. Thank you, thank you. Thank you so much. Always remember to love hard, forgive often and laugh frequent. Bye, guys, bye-bye.